Poll

How much would you for a mega patch to assist the developers with some funds?

$20 - it better be a game changer
7 (10.8%)
$15 - Big time improvement
1 (1.5%)
$10 - more features are good
2 (3.1%)
$5 - the right price to help a new developer on this one time
2 (3.1%)
Hell no patches are ment to be free, I will donate
43 (66.2%)
NOTE: this poll was created by a user and is in no way affliated with the Developers - its just a poll, please dont read too much in it.
10 (15.4%)

Total Members Voted: 65

Voting closed: January 07, 2011, 02:24:59 PM

Author Topic: Mega Patch for Nominal fee  (Read 9316 times)

general solomon

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Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« on: December 08, 2010, 02:24:59 PM »
Alright folks here is a poll that will be up for next 30 days. Let the Devs know what you think. I've been here only a couple days and I have noticed their dedication to this game.

shojin

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2010, 02:54:06 PM »
Patches are patches... they're free. Expansions on the other hand, would be huge changes, would most likely be pay for.
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Thy Reaper

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2010, 02:58:21 PM »
Unless it was really beyond our ability to provide patches for free, we would never even consider this.

general solomon

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2010, 03:16:07 PM »
Unless it was really beyond our ability to provide patches for free, we would never even consider this.

I know Reap are real gamers who like to develop games. then let us buy a new expansion. when is it coming out???

Tkins

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2010, 03:38:18 PM »
I know Reap are real gamers who like to develop games. then let us buy a new expansion. when is it coming out???

Probably not until after the game is finished.

general solomon

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2010, 08:03:28 PM »
Probably not until after the game is finished.

is there an eta on the finished product?

Warnstaff

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2010, 08:14:32 PM »
Pay for patches? NO! Pay for expansions or sequels? Considering that BMS has gone to continually great lengths to finish a game that mus developers and publishers abandon after release, I'll easily pay $100 for an expansion or sequel.

sethfc

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2010, 09:20:39 PM »
I would pay 39-50$'s for an expansion easily. But not for patches. afterall patches are fixes and content additions that were meant for the Original product. And i did buy the game already Which means i supported the devs. Since they put the game out early and it wasn't actually finished yet i paid for essentially a 'beta' and stayed on till now and its looking better every day.

Still i wouldn't mind paying them money for an expansion adding even more content. or if their company was going bankrupt i'd happily donate. I just don't want ANYONE  to pay for a patch..that seems ridiculous by definition of both the word patch and the word ridiculous lol.

Starlight

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2010, 02:26:52 AM »
I'm afraid I would never pay for a patch.  I probably would not be the best person to ask however, since I'm sketchy on paying for actual expansions.

How much of a miser I am aside, I think requesting payment for a patch would break the bond of trust between Gamer and Developer - we expect support when things break, do we not? 

Star Ruler is an exceptional case, after all, we paid full price for a game we knew wasn't finished, though I'm sure many of us consider it an investment, I do.  That twenty-odd quid was my last treat for myself out of this Semester's Student Loan money.  z: )

This is a game of two genres which more or less fizzled out after the end of the nineties, leaving so many of us wanting.  How long have we waited for Homeworld 3 or a sequel to Master of Orion 2? (Oh and yes, I meant two.)  Yet here came Star Ruler, a seeming fusion of both, appearing unsung on the list of games available on Steam as if we had willed it into existance, for indeed, some people had, with some serious hard work (and I'm a Computer Games Design student, so I know that it must have been a LOT of HARD work and that's just so far.)

I appreciate the Dev's promise that they would never charge for a patch unless it was really really necessary, not just because they're fufilling the unspoken promise they made to each of us that bought the game that they would finish it, but because they're visibly working tirelessly to complete it.  This game is a labour of love, ladies and gentlemen, you can tell they really want to get this right because this game deserves to exist dammit. 

So, if paying for a patch was really really necessary, because the Coders would be starving in their freezing windowless shed, I'd even consider paying for it.  If it was about a fiver.  Not likely though.  If you're expecting more dosh out of the likes of me then you really are... z: )
« Last Edit: December 09, 2010, 02:29:23 AM by Starlight »
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Dadekster

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2010, 01:29:09 PM »
If the title was changed to something like 'How much would you pay for an expansion' I'd say 20-40 bucks depending on what's in it. Maybe at the point an expansion comes out mods have the game where I am happy so an expansion is irrelevant. Many companies release expansions that are nothing more than a mega patch with a new map or two tossed in, and that pisses me off to no end. SotS always seemed to have the right idea to expansions in they tossed in new mods, races, engine techs etc.

But yeah, no one pays for a patch unless it's labeled expansion but some dubious PR ahole. Thankfully BMS doesn't seem to be afflicted with people like this.  ;)

erdiede

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2010, 09:48:37 PM »
I'd pay $20 if by mega patch you meant full cgi cutscenes, voice acting, single player or co-op campaign, and a gazillion races with a gazillion shipsets per race (ie a game that would "compete" with a large studio production, justifying a retroactive adjustment of the game's price to something commensurate with a large studio's game price tag).

As I see virtually no chance of this game heading in that direction, I will settle for a "budget" priced game that has a scale and versatility that a large studio would A) never attempt and B) screw up even if they did attempt.

So in short, KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK BMS, you have vastly exceeded my expectations for a game of this price point, and it just keeps getting better!!!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

shojin

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2010, 09:55:48 PM »
I'd pay $20 if by mega patch you meant full cgi cutscenes, voice acting, single player or co-op campaign, and a gazillion races with a gazillion shipsets per race (ie a game that would "compete" with a large studio production, justifying a retroactive adjustment of the game's price to something commensurate with a large studio's game price tag).

As I see virtually no chance of this game heading in that direction, I will settle for a "budget" priced game that has a scale and versatility that a large studio would A) never attempt and B) screw up even if they did attempt.

So in short, KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK BMS, you have vastly exceeded my expectations for a game of this price point, and it just keeps getting better!!!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

You'd only pay $20 if we made a full triple A title? What you mentioned is a ridiculous amount of work. We'd never do it, because it'd take that long to make an entirely new game, which would be 30-40 full price. I know we all don't like the $60 triple A prices, but we shouldn't break our backs for minimal return.

But yeah, no one pays for a patch unless it's labeled expansion but some dubious PR ahole. Thankfully BMS doesn't seem to be afflicted with people like this.  ;)
Firgof would totally con you into paying $700 for all the DLC we could put out. :D
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erdiede

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2010, 10:02:53 PM »
You'd only pay $20 if we made a full triple A title? What you mentioned is a ridiculous amount of work.

You missed the point... I already paid ~$20 for the game... If I paid an additional $20 that would be about ~$40. Which is well within the $30-40 price range you mentioned. Silly shojin  :P

***Well, if Firgof made $700 worth of DLC up the standards of the rest of the game, it wouldn't necessarily be a bad investment, as far as video games go... provided it was in small enough chunks, of course :D
« Last Edit: December 09, 2010, 10:10:57 PM by erdiede »

shojin

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2010, 10:22:59 PM »
You missed the point... I already paid ~$20 for the game... If I paid an additional $20 that would be about ~$40. Which is well within the $30-40 price range you mentioned. Silly shojin  :P

Yes, good for you, bad for us, since we could have made an entirely different game in that time span with most likely the same quality, so our time has to be worth the money.
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erdiede

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2010, 10:37:00 PM »
I guess I'm missing something... I paid $20 for a game which is still in progress and you can either A) add more content and charge a little more for it, or B) start a whole new game from scratch and charge twice as much for it with more content...

I guess I'm operating from the perspective that it would be easier to add a "couple" features that would be, admittedly, labor intensive and incredibly expensive to a game that is at a reasonable amount of completion then to start from scratch with a new engine AND add those same features. And if still assuming the 30-40 price point, would ultimately generate the same amount of money (either pay $20 twice over a period of time or $40 in a chunk after development is completed).

Needless to say, I feel that this conversation is heading into a slightly more heated direction than I anticipated, especially since I was trying to compliment BMS.  ???

s20dan

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #15 on: December 10, 2010, 12:33:24 AM »
Quote
I paid $20 for a game which is still in progress and you can either A) add more content and charge a little more for it, or B) start a whole new game from scratch and charge twice as much for it with more content...

You talk of making a new game like it is a simple task.
 It is not.

shojin

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #16 on: December 10, 2010, 06:49:27 AM »
I guess I'm missing something... I paid $20 for a game which is still in progress and you can either A) add more content and charge a little more for it, or B) start a whole new game from scratch and charge twice as much for it with more content...

I guess I'm operating from the perspective that it would be easier to add a "couple" features that would be, admittedly, labor intensive and incredibly expensive to a game that is at a reasonable amount of completion then to start from scratch with a new engine AND add those same features. And if still assuming the 30-40 price point, would ultimately generate the same amount of money (either pay $20 twice over a period of time or $40 in a chunk after development is completed).

Needless to say, I feel that this conversation is heading into a slightly more heated direction than I anticipated, especially since I was trying to compliment BMS.  ???

I'm not trying to make it heated, I'm just pointing out the obvious. What you said aren't a "couple" of features, but really huge things that would take time to implement, especially when the game right now isn't set to support most of them. Writing a new game from scratch with everything a triple A title has in mind might take the same amount of time as retroactively adding those features to star ruler.
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erdiede

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #17 on: December 10, 2010, 09:02:22 AM »
I realize that, but on the other hand paying for a patch is an almost unheard of event in modern computing, especially modern gaming. While I would be willing to pay enough money to bring the ultimate price of the game up to the standards of a full featured production, it would have to have all the features of a full featured game... that is all I was trying to convey. Not that I WANT those features per se, just that I would feel that if those features were added I WOULD pay another $20.

And I wasn't trying to discuss the practicality of it. I'm not sure how big your staff is, but I get the impression it is barely pushing 5; I would never actually expect 5 people to add CGI to a game, especially since it is a job that really needs to be done by dedicated specialists for it too look right, which I am guessing.

In terms of "scripted" missions, would it really be that hard? The way I understand the game seeding, it should regenerate the same map; if nothing else you could treat each mission as a save game, use some kind of console command to have several races colonize different parts of the galaxy; Depending on whether you win or lose a mission it dumps a tag into an "invisible" autosave, a new "campaign" screen then looks at the tag, plays the appropriate movie and loads the next appropriate mission.

Again, I'm not saying I want this, just that if I were to double my investment in the game I would expect a big addition to the game.

*** And I should specify that by full CGI and voice acting I didn't mean IN the game... but between "missions." I DON'T mean a little pop-up window during a game with a cute little animated insect eating a human limb screaming at me that it will turn my worlds into a nesting ground for its brood.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2010, 09:24:38 AM by erdiede »

Drpox

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #18 on: December 10, 2010, 11:21:30 AM »
Please note, The OP was not a dev asking for this.  At least, I dont recall him being a developer.  If the developers wanted to broach this subject which has never been hinted at, then they will ask.  Seriously rename the post or something.  This whole topic will just be a sore spot to an otherwise fantastic bunch of gamers and developers.

This was a player!!!

Thy Reaper

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #19 on: December 10, 2010, 11:30:04 AM »
And I wasn't trying to discuss the practicality of it. I'm not sure how big your staff is, but I get the impression it is barely pushing 5;

We have 3 people working on the game regularly.

shojin

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #20 on: December 10, 2010, 02:09:53 PM »
I realize that, but on the other hand paying for a patch is an almost unheard of event in modern computing, especially modern gaming.

With that big of an update it would be more of an expansion, because the game as it is right now, is at the point where we can start calling it finished. I personally think for a while now that features have just been getting added on, rather than 'finishing' the game.

And I wasn't trying to discuss the practicality of it. I'm not sure how big your staff is, but I get the impression it is barely pushing 5; I would never actually expect 5 people to add CGI to a game, especially since it is a job that really needs to be done by dedicated specialists for it too look right, which I am guessing.

Hence why it would really need to be worth our time. :P

In terms of "scripted" missions, would it really be that hard? The way I understand the game seeding, it should regenerate the same map; if nothing else you could treat each mission as a save game, use some kind of console command to have several races colonize different parts of the galaxy; Depending on whether you win or lose a mission it dumps a tag into an "invisible" autosave, a new "campaign" screen then looks at the tag, plays the appropriate movie and loads the next appropriate mission.

You'd have to take that up with one of the other developers, cause I don't know nothin bout no codin no scripts.

Again, I'm not saying I want this, just that if I were to double my investment in the game I would expect a big addition to the game.

I was under the impression we were talking about this right now. :P

I was just adding onto that, in a game where it really doesn't particularly need much of any of that (some people are content with a sandbox game), doing those features would cost us time. If we were able to say, start an entirely new project with a scope more driven to have a story and all of that (essentially what we would be doing to star ruler, minus making the game over again) I don't imagine it would take all that much longer just because Reaper codes faster than brains process.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2010, 06:27:16 PM by shojin »
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GrapeNaut

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2010, 05:57:41 PM »
I would hope that the game isn't deemed finished until combat has been fleshed out so that it's not so mysterious and incidental as it feels now. Just my opinion though.

erdiede

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #22 on: December 10, 2010, 09:27:08 PM »
With that big of an update it would be more of an expansion, because the game as it is right now, is at the point where we can start calling it finished. I personally think for a while now that features have just been getting added on, rather than 'finishing' the game.
Ultimately it is a question of semantics; if it was released AFTER the game is "really" finished, it's an expansion; if before, simply a purchased patch; as a reference I would mention BC3K, but I fear a long discussion of that abortion could lead to the whole BMS production staff being struck down with an airborne vCJD leading to a planetary apocalypse.

Also, in terms of what we are discussing, I was simply giving a wish-list of things I would enjoy seeing that would justify me paying more money for a patch; I am totally satisfied with the game as it is heading (baring a handful of bugs which are being fixed I am TOTALLY satisfied with the game) and in terms of money spent for my benefit, it definitely fits into my top 5 franchises (and yes I know this isn't a franchise yet, but one shouldn't preclude future events), with games like the I-War series, Baldur's Gate series, and Fallout 1 & 2 (though the BG series and Fallout 1 & 2 are my faves, probably for life... I don't think a game will ever be made that can compete with the originals of either series).
« Last Edit: December 10, 2010, 09:32:58 PM by erdiede »

general solomon

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #23 on: December 10, 2010, 11:57:50 PM »
folks,
this poll was created by me a fellow gamer. I added a disclaimer to reflect this. I don't work for the developers.

I personally would pay 15.00 for a more enhanced patch/expansion. No need to start reading too much into this. its just a poll. I have seen people pay over 50 bucks for crappier games.


the game may not be finished, but i really like the fact that its open for a player to mod virtually any section. What i thought of yesterday was it would take this game to the next level if a ship editor was available in the game. you start out with the base designs and in the editor see visually what the ship would look like if you added the subsystems.

i think this would satisfy most visual gamers that like spaceship eye candy.

RazorTS

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #24 on: December 13, 2010, 11:09:57 AM »
Pay for patch? Ehm. Lets finish the game 1st

Dadekster

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2010, 01:33:32 PM »
folks,
this poll was created by me a fellow gamer. I added a disclaimer to reflect this. I don't work for the developers.

I personally would pay 15.00 for a more enhanced patch/expansion. No need to start reading too much into this. its just a poll. I have seen people pay over 50 bucks for crappier games.


the game may not be finished, but i really like the fact that its open for a player to mod virtually any section. What i thought of yesterday was it would take this game to the next level if a ship editor was available in the game. you start out with the base designs and in the editor see visually what the ship would look like if you added the subsystems.

i think this would satisfy most visual gamers that like spaceship eye candy.

I think most people understand this, we're all just playing devils advocate.  :)

Captiva

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2010, 05:35:03 PM »
With that big of an update it would be more of an expansion, because the game as it is right now, is at the point where we can start calling it finished. I personally think for a while now that features have just been getting added on, rather than 'finishing' the game.

I do not agree with this statement at all.  2 patches ago, you could barely play a game of SR for more than a few hours without total meltdown, 1.0.2.8 was more stable, but had many gamebreaking bugs, such as vanishing ships, broken tools, etc etc...
1.0.3.0 is the only version of the game that I would call "good enough". but it is still missing alot of details, and features, and tweaks.  As long as nothing game breaking is added, they could maybe call it finished in a couple more patches, but I hope they continue to "tweak it" for a little while.
The Devs have done a great job of supporting the game so far, and I think they will continue to for a while.



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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2010, 05:39:44 PM »
Quote
The Devs have done a great job of supporting the game so far, and I think they will continue to for a while.
We will and thanks. :)
"Now it will punish you"

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2010, 05:50:34 PM »
I do not agree with this statement at all.  2 patches ago, you could barely play a game of SR for more than a few hours without total meltdown, 1.0.2.8 was more stable, but had many gamebreaking bugs, such as vanishing ships, broken tools, etc etc...
1.0.3.0 is the only version of the game that I would call "good enough". but it is still missing alot of details, and features, and tweaks.  As long as nothing game breaking is added, they could maybe call it finished in a couple more patches, but I hope they continue to "tweak it" for a little while.
The Devs have done a great job of supporting the game so far, and I think they will continue to for a while.

That's why I'm saying at the moment it's good enough to be considered 'finished'. It's stable, therefore finished. The different between that and fleshed out is what you want. I'm not saying the devs should stop at all, because this game deserves to be made better and better. But at this point, most main features are in, and just need to be fleshed out a bit.
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Philthy

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Re: Mega Patch for Nominal fee
« Reply #29 on: December 14, 2010, 09:51:30 AM »
Would be happy to buy any expansion that might come out. Big additions, like new races with different technology trees. Or a new technology expansion that has tons of new models, weapons, ship systems, etcs. A new campaign expansion that may have a very drawn out and more linear based game to play through with certain events that will always happen at certain times (Like 4 hours in 1/4 of the galaxy vanishes in an explosion and a new race makes an appearance, 5 hours in the other AIs that you may or may not be fighting at this point all ask for alliances to go against the new threat, etc. ) Scripted campaigns would be pretty awesome. I know the game is all about sandbox 4x, just throwing out suggestions for additional stuff I would be happy paying for!