Author Topic: [Idea] Radar  (Read 1004 times)

Extell

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[Idea] Radar
« on: August 03, 2011, 01:58:32 PM »
One of my favorite space sims is the Homeworld series. And one aspect of that series that I think would work wonders in Star Ruler is the radar. With the radar you can only "see" so far away from your ships. You had special ships (Probes and Radars) that would allow you to see MUCH further than usual. I feel this would be a great fit for Star Ruler. It would fit easily into the Sensor's research.

The idea behind this would be that you would need to deploy a probes or sensor scouts to be able to detect objects in the systems your in. So, sending a ship with just a hull, power, thrusters and crew to a new system would not reveal the entire system. You would actually have to have your scout ship fitted with at least a basic sensor package and then fly around the system to find the planets. Its basic enough for your homeworld to have a "Hubble" to see where stars are, but to actually see where the planets are in that system you would need to send probes or scout ships to find them. With a bit of further research in sensors you could detect planets within a certain AU of your already established worlds. And, finding asteroid systems would be a bit harder since you do not have a bright ball of flaming goodness in their center.

The other part of this would that you would need to deploy a sensor net to find/track your enemies. You can craft something like the Homeworld probe (computer core and massive sensor package) and line areas of space with them to provide you with an early detection system for when ships are coming your way. Or send a construction based ship to locations to build a larger radar system to expand your empires view.

One other thing this would open up would be an better stealth system. If you can get a ship to hide from radar (Radar size/level VS Stealth Field size/level) you could make better scouts/probes or give your enemies one heck of a surprise attack. If their radar is lacking, they may not even know your there until you attack (Im picturing some really good stealth torpedo bombers).


GGLucas

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Re: [Idea] Radar
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2011, 02:05:16 PM »
This is not technically feasible considering the large amounts of ships the engine needs to track.

Aside from that, it would also take far too much micromanagement to set up these sensor nets, it's not likely to be beneficial to gameplay.

Lastly, it's also not terribly realistic. Stealth in space is hard. When you have a ship in a system, pretty much everything in that system is suddenly within visual range and can be detected by passive sensors pretty easily.

rogerano

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Re: [Idea] Radar
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2011, 09:35:58 PM »
Passive sensors are usually defined as devices which listen for emissions. If an object has emissions below the sensitivity of the listening device, or sends emissions in a direction which is not being monitored, or makes emissions not being listened for, it cannot be detected.

Stealth may be hard in SR, but I actually believe it would be fairly trivial to achieve in reality under the right conditions. Space is big. ;) I'm fairly sure it would impossible to hide a massive fleet of warships. Or maybe not. In any case, a cleverly designed warship could make itself quite difficult to detect and track from a distance. Which is ok, since my personal objective for a stealthy warship would be to have it hard to detect / hit at a distance and then once close enough, have it unleash hell (and be detected, naturally).

A big chunk of metal draped in a big bit of rock-colored cloth would be indistinguishable from a proper rock, provided our chunk of metal didn't activate high powered emitters (until the right time :D). Perfect ambush.

Texada

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Re: [Idea] Radar
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2011, 02:18:04 AM »
Passive sensors are usually defined as devices which listen for emissions. If an object has emissions below the sensitivity of the listening device, or sends emissions in a direction which is not being monitored, or makes emissions not being listened for, it cannot be detected.

Stealth may be hard in SR, but I actually believe it would be fairly trivial to achieve in reality under the right conditions. Space is big. ;) I'm fairly sure it would impossible to hide a massive fleet of warships. Or maybe not. In any case, a cleverly designed warship could make itself quite difficult to detect and track from a distance. Which is ok, since my personal objective for a stealthy warship would be to have it hard to detect / hit at a distance and then once close enough, have it unleash hell (and be detected, naturally).

A big chunk of metal draped in a big bit of rock-colored cloth would be indistinguishable from a proper rock, provided our chunk of metal didn't activate high powered emitters (until the right time :D). Perfect ambush.

With current off-the-shelf technology on earth with passive sensors

I could detected the Space Shuttle's main engines firing off as far as past the orbit of Pluto
if it fired off it's manoeuvering thrusters then as far as the asteroid belt

a ship using ion drive to thrust at 1/1000 of a g could be spotted at one astronomical unit.

Even just the ships life support would make enough heat to be detected at an exceedingly long range.

Someone_From_The_Dark

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Re: [Idea] Radar
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2011, 07:44:29 PM »
With current off-the-shelf technology on earth with passive sensors

I could detected the Space Shuttle's main engines firing off as far as past the orbit of Pluto
if it fired off it's manoeuvering thrusters then as far as the asteroid belt

a ship using ion drive to thrust at 1/1000 of a g could be spotted at one astronomical unit.

Even just the ships life support would make enough heat to be detected at an exceedingly long range.
The moral of the story here? Space is cold. ;)

rogerano

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Re: [Idea] Radar
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2011, 11:37:28 PM »
I'm pretty sure heat isn't the deal-breaker you make it out be. There are an awful lot of "ifs" when it comes to positive and definite detection, tracking and identification of sentient bogies.

And "With current off-the-shelf technology on earth with passive sensors" is equally applicable to the implementation of detection counter-measures.

Someone_From_The_Dark

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Re: [Idea] Radar
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2011, 02:04:30 PM »
Another thing; using radar takes twice as long as using passive sensors, because the radar wave propagates at the speed of light (IIRC) and then after reflecting has to travel back across the distance between the object and the radar installation. So you get an outdated image of a ship that can see you and has already done something about it.